|N Marion Hage: Love at first sight. Is it possible? (Also posted at Academici)|
9 comments9 Mar 2006 @ 14:04 by Susie @126.96.36.199 : love at first sight
I disagree, there is love at first sight if you make it, love in the first encounter.
9 Mar 2006 @ 16:45 by poetsong : Interesting
I won't disagree. A loving person may love intelligently if they understand the demands of love, from the beginning.
Here I'm talking about romantic love specifically, and my point is that there is a chemical responce to newness, mystery, physical attraction, that really isn't love at all. Some people are really that likable that you never stop liking them, loving them. However, you see after a time that there is a substance behind the picture.
In many cases, it's like the great and powerful Oz, smoke and mirrors. What you see outwardly is not who this other person is. And so, you can't really love them until you see past the barriers, past what they show you, and outward physical attraction.
Some people have charisma, and charm, and they are physically beautiful. It's harder to tire of people that come in that package. If they also happen to be faithful, and interesting, and going in the same direction, I imagine it would take a really nasty set back to cause someone to dislike them.
But if they are all that, then what's happening is that when the chemical love begins to fade, they have such substance, we may always feel strong bonds to them. But again, if they are that way, then the whole world generally wants to be with them, and the only thing that sets us apart from the world is whether or not we found them first, and they liked us back.
Most people in the world are not that package. They are filled with wounds, conflicts, diverging opinions, and they are changing or unfortunately aren't growing at all. And so, people who came into a relationship with chemical attraction are moving apart from the moment they commit.
Once we understand the dynamics of Chemical love- we begin to be honest about who they are, and more often, have to make a conscious choice to remember the good in them. If you marry or get into a relationship with a complex person, there may be just as much to repulse you as attract you. And at this point, if Chemical love is all there is, and no part of the will, that relationship only stands upon the fact they still make you feel perpetually good.
Lots of people are with people, and don't want to be. My point is that in these cases, love for the other might override that sudden desire to go looking for the next "Soul-mate". How many soul-mates can be wrong? For some people, they have an endless string of broken relationships and not because there was nothing to love in the other, but because they didn't really understand love is what enables us to find the good in others, and nurture it, and form stronger bonds.
Lets face it. Some people are cotton candy. And we may at some core level desire them. However, great relationships often come between two imperfect people with the will to love each other, overcoming momentary lapses in feelings for each other.
9 Mar 2006 @ 17:13 by Susie @188.8.131.52 : this verification thing is making me cra
:) but I married a man I fell in love with on the first date, remember... But yes, you need to know who the person is behind the mask. The thing is if you meet a person without a mask on to begin with, you can fall in love with who they are and stay there. The problem is too many people want to make a good first impression instead of showing who they really are inside at the start. Its a waste of time of course, because if you don't show who you are to begin with you spend a lot of time hiding you from potential partners and friends and then are dissappointed when they don't respond to the real you later. Its so much easier to be you all around and not be who you think you SHOULD be instead. Or as Doctor Suess says... "say what you mean and mean what you say because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"
10 Mar 2006 @ 14:01 by poetsong : I love Dr Suess!
And I love this discussion. My answer isn't related to you, but just there is so much to say on this, I'd like to use it as a springboard, if you don't mind.
Hiding is endemic in the world. It's far more prevelent than someone wanting someone to like them. In general, most people fear being completely seen for who they are, because they fear being judged and abandoned. Fear and anger are roots to most of mankind's problems.
However, in terms of hiding in the dating sense, I think less is contrived; and it is mostly a combination of poor judgment and delusions. When people are young, they really don't know who they are, or not well. They may actually believe, "I'm a nice guy..." because they don't spit when they order a beer, or drool. The best way to see what's in a person's heart is to live with them.
Some people have no idea how lazy they are, until they realize everyone else is doing dishes and cleaning up and they are sitting there like a slug on a rug. And even then, some don't get it until everyone starts shouting, "Clean up you slug!" And so, you have the real world. Otherwise, they'll happily leach off the hard work of others.
Heck, if mommy took care of them and did everything, they might not realize something will be expected from them when they marry, have kids...etc. And so, you have this person thinking, "I'm a great catch...I have my own hair and teeth...I work at a fast food place...and I have no really nasty habbits! Girls gotta love me!"
Well, they come all smiles and like they are doing a woman a favor by choosing to bless them with their company, not really knowing that some day she will have some demands and expectations. And she might assume he'll just get it. Guys never get it until someone clues them in. That's a rule with few exceptions. Fortunately some guys get clues before they get into a relationship. But look at a guy's section of the magazine rack- pictures of women, pictures of cars, and pictures of jocks playing some game. Look at the women's section- how to find a man...how to keep a man...what do men want...
Yes, we rarely know the people we marry these days. It's a mobile society, and people generally meet in work or school, and not the girl they knew all their lives next door. They don't know them, their family, only a presentation in a small frame of time. It's like "The Bachelor in Paris", 21 days to fall in love.
It's not always that the other person is being deceptive, but it's true we don't generally see all sides of a person. People are complex. In one arena they are all smiles, but in another they brood all day long. That may be real. It isn't they are always putting on a false face, though some can, but in a bar, some people might come alive around their friends, but have terrible coping skills for dealing with bills and relationship friction, and so they escape into one world, and are sad in the other, even if they love the people in both.
In general, good-willed people are not that insightful about relationships, and men are far worse than women. Society does little to teach good relationship dynamics. Even in movies, and books, and portrayed love, we see two people falling in love superficially. It's like a reality show where you see a perfect presentation, but not who they are when life's pressures come bearing down.
In my experience, the problem with men is that we generally change slowly, if at all. We are creatures of habbit, and getting us to do something new is hard. In fact, men get entrenched in things, which again has a downside. It's as if we are designed for single tasks- hunter gatherer- and so we have a propensity to get absorbed in things.
In my experience, women grow and change from the moment they find a relationship. In a sense, a stable relationship is like a launch pad for some women, and they really begin exploring who they are and what they are after they find who they want.
In most cases, you have someone who is really not moving, and someone constantly moving, and so the sense is that during a relationship they are growing apart. There may be lots of exceptions to this, but it is a general rule.
And so, for relationships to grow, two people have to believe in committment and the value of growing above comfort. There will be periods where people don't feel on the same page.
For us to really get anywhere, we need to things in life, the right motivation and the right game plan. In general, if you have one of the two, you are heads and shoulders above most relationships. Unfortunately in most relationships you have two people who are mostly self-centered wondering, "Hey, what do I get out of the deal?" and no worthwhile gameplan to make anything positive happen.
And so, people bail. Instead of learning about themselves and this other person, which really requires determination, they simply etch-a-sketch, and look for "Soul-Mate". This may sound against the grain, but any two souls can connect if they want to. And even if one is really motivated and insightful, they can kindle life and growth in the other, setting them on the course to be that "Soul-Mate".
In all of this, I have to say that true love (in one who believes in committment) can overcome, and prevail, and find themselves in the most fulfilling relationship they could have imagined, with the person they one time wondered if they could even have feelings for again.
Honestly, I have seen some of the worst marriages in the world turn around, with people who pulled knives on each other (By the way...I don't suggest anyone stay where one puts another in danger)I don't council them to divorce, especially if they really want to work things out; but in some cases space between them is necessary until things are resolved to prevent them from doing something stupid.
I only say this because far too many people quite relationships too easily, and that I've seen what would be called impossible relationships, where I'd have couples in an F-U fest screaming like kids demanding daddy's attention, where both parties had the other arrested on numerous occassions, turn around and fall in love with each other.
No, I'm not telling anyone in this kind of relationship this always happens, but it's nice to know that miracles happen, especially for people in need of a miracle.
In some cases this is a recipee for friction. A guy who seems fun and parties, is fun while there are few life demands and both can party together. But when the party is over, and it's time to grow up, some guys will fight to hold onto that, which really slows growth together.
10 Mar 2006 @ 19:35 by Susie @184.108.40.206 : discussions...
Its been too long since we've done this!
10 Mar 2006 @ 19:50 by poetsong : Do what; quote Dr Suess?
We can do it more if you'd like. Wasn't there something about a cat in a funky hat?
13 Mar 2006 @ 19:51 by poetsong : Just kidding about Dr Suess -
I'm glad others enjoy serious conversations.
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