|New Civilization News: In quest of a New Civilization: Summary and going ahead|
Category: Social System Design
15 comments7 Aug 2008 @ 16:31 by a-d : Paragraf Eight.....
....I must say "hmmmmm" to that one....that Human Mind would be in it's Highest of evolution (UNLESS this is what you mean with "Highest" , but I do not see you as one , who would find pleasure in PRETENSE, nor MALICE!... : Mark Twain once wrote, “Heaven is by favor; if it were by merit your dog would go in and you would stay out. Of all the creatures ever made [man] is the most detestable. Of the entire brood, he is the only one… that possesses malice. He is the only creature that inflicts pain for sport, knowing it to be pain.” ) at this moment ... which statement I perceive to be swimming in the undercurrents of this statement, I don't know if I am willing to buy into!...nor did Jesus!.... nor did the Buddha, nor did so many others, who managed to brake away from the curse of the COMATOSE Mankind ( a BIG part of Humans are in there, in that corral!... ALL of MAINSTREAM; all the Sheeple, you know, those who follow without as much as second thought... their leaders, regardless how sick actions these leaders perform!... AND DEMAND from the Sheeple blind obedience--"or else"! !.... NOT VERY ( much of ) COSMIC Activity there!....
Humans do NOT --as a group-- buy too much into integrity!... "I do what I say, and say what I do!.... and if I change my Mind in between,I let you know!.... but I do not cheat you and I am true to my Missions" THAT would be to have integrity, that would be to be Evolved!... I agree with our friend Jeffry here on NCN, when he says, that he sees Earth Worm to have more integrity than (most) Humans!....NOR is TECHNOLOGY a good Substitute for Cosmic ABILITIES IGNORED by us!... No Airplane can be better than God-given (Mind power for ) Teleportation for instance!.... Nor is any "Medical Advance" better than to be naturally so intuned and in HARMONY with your own body and NATURE/LIFE, that you can keep your body naturally, spontaneously, healthy at all times... as it is DESIGNED to be!....etc. etc. etc.
...and let's NOT forget, that GOD/LIFE did NOT create/demand death to a cosmic Mandatory "transition" into Anything at all!.... that is ALL HUMAN Hogwash!.... "thanks" to humanity having indeed DE-volved (=fallen back from a higher State to a lower... and hence ) deep into UN-consciousness from which we have been crawling up & out again for the last two-three thousand years...
HUMANS "created" a MANDATORY Death within a certain cluster of frequencies of Cosmic vibrations ... ALL is Cosmic Vibration.... some higher, some lower... and the lowest being doomed to death... which never has been anything but accidental!....because we were never meant to for this low vibration!... NOTHING , nor NOBODY on Earth was meant for this low vibration where death is a man-made mandatory thing. Not even Plants nor Animals.We as the Stewards, forced this condition on them!... Mother Nature/Gaia will re-adjust Herself and Her Loyals to follow UNIVERSE, not us, humans !... eventually!
Hopefully some of the things said in this comment will also (begin) to cover a few of your (in later paragrafs) stated (rhetorical) Questions as to "why" Mankind-"this", Mankind-"that"!... yuppp.... we need to get back fully where and what we were/always are intended to be by Life. Nothing less will do!.... in that I totally agree with you! : )
8 Aug 2008 @ 14:41 by shreepal : Evolution, lower, higher evolution, mind
Paragraf eight says: "The highest evolved form of life on earth is the ‘intelligent Mind’ of humans. It reasons...." etc.
We have to start our case from "what we know today as true (though ultimately it may turn out to be false from from a state of our consciousness, which is still alien to us and therefore from which state we are still incapable of seeing things)".
We say it is true that there is life on earth, that there are many forms of this life on earth, that human beings have life, that this life is less evolved in some forms and more evolved in some other forms, that human beings are more evolved than, say, trees. Is it not so? If it is not so, then there is no common acceptable foundation between us to proceed further.
But I think you would agree that there is life on earth, that there are different stages of this life's evolution on earth - some less and some more evolved. It is taught so in our schools even to our kids.
Why should we reject as wrong that is found to be correct by our science? Science may be an imperfect tool to search truth but it is not correct to say whatever it states is wrong. Truth demands from us that we must accept that "steam has force, that electricity is the flow of electrons, that gravity is a force" etc.
We can not promote dreams as truths by denouncing the truths discovered by science. We use these discoveries in our daily life; and we have no moral right to denounce them as false.
The only contentious thing is that there are certain things which are true but which the science still does not know - has not discovered yet.
If we two walk along this much, then the question would arise whether humans have "developed mind" or not. If it is developed one, is it more developed one than that of an animal?
What is the measure of this "mental development"? One who can make a "computer" is more developed than the one who cannot do so. It is as simple as that. Is it not so? Whay should we always run against reason?
I always hold that reason is not perfect instrument to uncover the truth; but then what is that instrument that is better than reason? We can always say this or that thing is better than the reason but unless one goes beyond reason and firmly secures that thing, one cannot jettison the reason. This position is neither here nor there; it is idle talking.
We have to use reason, we have to proceed along reason and we have to trascend reason. It does not mean going against reason. Is it not so?
10 Aug 2008 @ 00:27 by a-d : I let these two
comments with whatever intelligence, Power of Cosmic Truth, and even "science", they each might contain , speak for themselves... and I rest my case! : )
10 Aug 2008 @ 08:54 by shreepal : Relativity of truth sanctified by time:
I completely agree with this attitude. This is the best attitude on our part; who are we to judge the right or wrong of what we say? All statements are relative only; there is nothing absolute in whatever we say. We all are caged in the capsule of time (in which we live) and circumstances (in which we are placed). It is the truth alone expressed commensurate with time and through people that provides sanctity of truth to that expression for that age.
11 Aug 2008 @ 22:07 by FedNix @18.104.22.168 : Endings and Beginnings
"After pointing out their defects, we propose to suggest a decisively effective and completely peaceful method of ending the current civilization and substituting it with a new one."
Kudos, up to this point. But you still have a long way to go. I'd be curious to check out the plausibility of your methods of ending an old civilization and beginning another one. Ambitious project, to say the least. ;-)
The conclusions I've reached during my seven decade time span here is that the current economic models we (our world order) are using are corrupt, and indeed need changing. But it is probably too late to effect those changes, peacefully or otherwise. The forces of the NWO are too powerful, entrenched, evil, and ruthless. We are in something very akin to a "Star Wars" situation here on our little isolated planet.
Cutting to the bottom line, we are now entering an apocalyptic situation, where much if not most of our current civilization will self-destruct. It will change itself, and all that really spiritually minded idealists need do is lay down a network for drawing up plans for this new civilization. Most likely it will need to be rebuilt from the ground up, with new local constitutions, charters of liberties and freedoms with commensurate responsibilities.
The big task will be to identify what flaws have existed in our current constitutions that have allowed today's conditions to evolve, and then correct those flaws. No small task to be sure :-)
The biggest flaws I have found is in balancing public, corporate and private powers, and representation of real live human citizens at every government level.
Specifically the system of creating and controlling money properly belongs with the people, i.e., a representative government. Today it is controlled by private central bankers who create money out of nothing and indebt our civilization with usurious interest rates. We wind up with unrepayable unsustainable debt.
We have to limit the size and power of corporations. We now have government of, by and for the corportations and bankers, rather than the citizens.
We have to provide for genuine education and information, without which a republic or democracy cannot long be sustained.
We have to elect and select the best and brightest among us for public office and trust. Few men or women of real integrity would subject themselves to today's electoral Roman Circus.
We have to provide lifelong education for those who wish to progress as citizens. Sufferage should be differentiated so that the best and brightest citizens can earn extra ballots through educational and civic achievement and service.
I could go on, but my time is limited. In summary I will repeat that I doubt that anything anyone could do could prevent the dissolution and eventual destruction of the current World Order. A purely profit-motivated economics is doomed. Our system of representation and checks and balances must be rethought and overhauled.
I will recommend some reading or viewing material:
Simplest Video on money = Money as Debt (47 min) : http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279
Comprehensive Video on money = MoneyMasters (3.5 hrs): http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936
Best Book (By Far) = Ellen H Brown's, Web of Debt: http://webofdebt.wordpress.com/feedback/ (Publisher's website reviews and comments) Amazon Reviews of Web of Debt: http://www.amazon.com/review/product/0979560810/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
Web of Debt website: http://www.webofdebt.com
Another Best Book = The Lost Science of Money - The Mythology of Money – The Story of Power: ttp://www.amazon.com/review/product/1930748035/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
American Monetary Reform: http://www.monetary.org
Best History, Comprehensive = Carrol Quigley - Tragedy and Hope: http://www.amazon.com/review/product/094500110X/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
Some good moments = Video: America: Freedom to Fascism: http://www.amazon.com/review/product/1930748035/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
Chris Martenson's Crash Course on Economics and Money: (videos in small segments)http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse=1
12 Aug 2008 @ 10:15 by shreepal : Uprooting old order without violence
Necessity is the mother of invention, goes the old adge. You have really pin-pointed the 'cause' and the 'solution' of the problem. I really admire your keen insight into the problem with which the humanity is suffering today and you have also indicated its 'solution'. The only question left is the 'plausibility' of the method to cure the defect.
You rightly say:
(1) 'the current economic models we (our world order) are using are corrupt, and indeed need changing. But it is probably too late to effect those changes, peacefully or otherwise. The forces of the NWO are too powerful, entrenched, evil, and ruthless.'
(2)'the system of creating and controlling money properly belongs with the people, i.e., a representative government'.
(3)'We have to provide for genuine education and information, without which a republic or democracy cannot long be sustained. We have to provide lifelong education for those who wish to progress as citizens'.
(4)'Sufferage should be differentiated so that the best and brightest citizens can earn extra ballots through educational and civic achievement and service.'
Nos. (1)and (2) are absolutely correct; No. (3) is is the haveist of odds against us; and No. (4) needs a little rethinking. I intend to cover all these items in my comming articles in details; please bear till then.
About No. (3): The crux of the problem, as I see it, are the people - the people as they are: the ignorant of the nature of things happening around them, careless to remove this ignorance, being busy with the trivial things leaving things that make and unmake their fate on this earth in the hands of those who pretend to be their friends but are in fact foes. And, government of the, for the, by the people, in the mean time, runs amock over these 'slumbering people'.This is the haviist odd against the chance of a change of the world order. It was this slumberness of people that communist invented the idea of 'the vanguard of the working class', a group of highly intelligent and motivated group of individuals. It was a necessity to 'fill the gap' caused by ignorant and almost ;sleeping' people. And, then, people had to repay for their 'carelessness in protecting their rights' by their life under the dictatorship. Is it possible to bring a change without violence? Let us see.
12 Sep 2008 @ 23:15 by b : The shift
Conciousness of all human could change if we all perceived the same cataclysmic event and delt with it the same way. If we go on it could be credits for done deals. You do what y ou say and pay or get paid.
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Other entries in Social System Design
29 Nov 2008 @ 22:27: THE ENEMY WITHIN
12 Mar 2008 @ 17:14: The Vital Necessity for Agreement
6 Aug 2007 @ 11:40: America The Vindictive
13 Jun 2007 @ 17:47: Scale of confront, including mechanics of polarization
15 Jul 2006 @ 16:05: Global Assembly Progress Report
2 Jun 2006 @ 14:11: Boring or Specific?
19 Apr 2006 @ 12:52: The Global Social Reality
10 Feb 2006 @ 08:13: The true you
7 Jan 2006 @ 12:57: The Unworkable Practice of Permanent Leadership
5 Jan 2006 @ 14:00: Humanity against the Machine